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The eMarketing Digest
© 1996 - 2008
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                     The E-Marketing Digest
                      Volume #2, Issue #3
                         May 12, 1997
                    Gary K. Foote, Moderator


Table of Contents

+ Moderator Comments

    "Ethical, Proactive Direct Marketing by E-mail"
       - An upcoming multi-part 'case study'

+ New Subjects

       - Bob Rankin

+ Ongoing

    "Spam software or e-marketer's tool?"
       - Andrey Yastrebov
       - David Bredeweg

    "The definition of spam"
       - Andrey Yastrebov
       - Stephen Ayer

    "Respect for your market"
       - Gary K. Foote, Moderator

+ Introductions
      - Frank Wiley

+ The Corkboard

     "One possible solution to spam"
       - Phil Doyle
       - Moderator's $.02


+ Moderator Comments

Beginning sometime next week I will be publishing a multi-part series
entitled, "Ethical, Proactive Direct Marketing by E-mail".  This
series will present a 'case study' of an imaginary e-mail marketing
campaign, including the complete development of sales materials,
targeting and e-mailing the market, helpful e-mail software hints,
writing and sending out press releases, posting to newsgroups and

This series will run in this publication - the E-Marketing Digest -
and will be available for a short time on the Digest website at:

+ New Subjects

From: Bob Rankin 
Subject: Taboo?


In your introductory posting, you made the comment:

  "The idea of promoting by e-mail in any form was considered a
  major taboo as recently as a few short months ago."

I must take issue, since we've been running the Internet Tourbus as a
sponsored mailing list since mid-1995.  At the time, it was rare
(possibly unheard of) to see sponsor ads right in-line with the text
of a moderated mailing list.

Using the TV/radio model of "And now... a message from our sponsor",
we've had good success in attracting advertisers - and they've told
us it works for them.  But the interesting thing is that with over
80,000 readers in 120 countries, I can count the number of complaints
about commercial content on one hand.

If you run a sponsored mailing list, your goals should be to:

1) attract a large following with free, high-quality content
2) build a good rapport with your audience
3) help your advertisers to capitalize on that good relationship

Bob Rankin
Tourbus Driver -

[Moderator's reply]


Your publication, "Tourbus", is well known to me as I am one of your
80,000 subscribers.  Even after three years of online marketing I
still find it a valuable resource...  and fun too.  You are right,
promoting on lists has been going on for much longer than a 'few
short months' as I stated so flatly [with foot firmly inserted in

Buying space on mailinglists is certainly a viable, and spam-free
method for advertising by e-mail.  In fact, starting a mailinglist on
a subject related to your product or service is a great way of
promoting by e-mail.  The bad news is that running a list is very
time consuming [I should know, I run many myself].

Mailing lists, and their used for e-mail marketing, will be covered
in Part IV of my upcoming series, "Ethical, Proactive Direct
Marketing by E-mail".


+ Ongoing

From: Andrey Yastrebov 
Subject: Re: Spam software or e-marketer's tool

Andy Rebele  wrote:

>What is offensive about AY Mail is the sentence from your web
>   You can customize headers for the messages you are sending
>This feature is one which is very useful for spammers and not very
>useful for people who are legitimately sending mail to their

[moderator snip]

I think you misunderstood this feature. Any e-mail package allows you
to customize "From:" field - it doesn't know your e-mail address, so
you have to supply it. If I disable this feature by putting in there
something non-changeable all the e-mail will be anonymous and I don't
think this is good for legitimate users.

The line you cited was mostly about "To:" field. Most of e-mail
packages put in there the whole list of recipients and it looks ugly
if you get an e-mail with 100-200 addresses listed in "To:". AY Mail
allows putting in there everything you want. This is very nice
feature for legitimate users. Moreover, AY Mail allows you to
customize "To:" field so that every recipient will see his own
address in there. Also not very useful for spammers.

Regards. Andrey.
| Andrey B. Yastrebov    E-mail:      |
|                |


From: "David Bredeweg" 
Subject: Use of E-mail programs

Response to Andrey B. Yastrebov in her comments in Vol 2, #1

Everything was good, but once I have been told that this is very bad
software because it may be used for spamming. That's probably true,
but what if some company wants to send e-mail to all their clients,
or somebody needs to distribute software upgrade, or send follow-up
letters. Don't they have to do it manually just because some bad
spammers can use tools like mine in a bad way?

The argument that something is bad because someone can misue it is
rediculous. I personally use a email program that was designed from
spam but it also works very efficiently for my newsletter and opt-in
mail list mailings. I also use it to contact all of the classified
listings in our malls.
The program is not bad. It is the user who abuses or misuses the
program that makes the act bad, not the software.
Cars are bad, because we all can make mistakes with them, some do
abuse the privilege, does that make all cars bad, thus we should not
produce them or at the least drive them?
David Bredeweg            NetMark Communications
Website Designer
Sales of Virtual Servers, hosting
Voice 561-641-9887         Fax 561-433-3979
Free Website Design/Development with Server purchase!

***  NEW POST - NEW TOPIC  ***

From: Andrey Yastrebov 
Mime-Version: 1.0
Content-Type: text/plain; charset="us-ascii"

Moderator wrote:

>Spam is:
>    Any unsolicited e-mail, whether widely broacast through
>    e-mail or USENET, or sent to a single recipient.

This definition isn't correct. Any advertisement is unsolicited,
because it is to inform people about something they don't know
anything about. So, according to your definition any advertisement
is a spam (which of course may be true).

Regards. AY.
| Andrey B. Yastrebov    E-mail:      |
|                |


Subject: Definitions, continued

What is the definition of spam?

Just what IS the definition of spam?  I believe that one of the
things we, as a group of interested internet marketers, must do is
answer this question.
Spam is:

    Any unsolicited e-mail, whether widely broacast through
    e-mail or USENET, or sent to a single recipient.
And the requirement for definitions continues:

What does "...widely broadcast through...USENET..." actually mean?

If I have an 'ad' that I want to post in some usegroups, and I first
check out the groups and find that they consist mostly of 'ads'
(which I would then interpret as being OK to post to), when does it
become inappropriate to post? Is there a certain quantity? And, what
of 'cross-posting'? Is it better to post an 'individual' ad to 20 or
so different newsgroups (assume appropriate) ==OR== is it better to
(cross) post that same ad ONE TIME to 20 or so different groups?

One thing I think is clear.  This is not black and white.  I look
forward to everyones response.  Thank you.


From: (Stephen Ayer)
Subject: re: What is the definition of spam?

>Any unsolicited e-mail, whether widely broacast through
>    e-mail or USENET, or sent to a single recipient.


I agree with much of your definition, however, I think SPAM implies a
message of a commercial, or self serving nature.  I can think of
several situations where an unsolicited e-mail to a single recipient
wouldn't be considered SPAM (at least not by me).  For example an
e-mail to a website owner asking to trade links.  This is
unsolicited, unless the website asks you to contact the webmaster to
trade links.

My definition:

Any unsolicited e-mail advertisement, whether widely broacast through
e-mail or USENET, or sent to a single recipient.

Stephen Ayer

Internet Marketing Solutions
48 Nursery La., Madison, CT  06443  Lowest Prices for iMALL Classifieds
--Internet Business Gym: a fitness center for online business

***  NEW POST - NEW TOPIC  ***

Subject: Respect for your market
From Gary K. Foote, moderator

Sunni Wrote;

>People want to be treated with kindness and respect --
>and that at the end of every email (or other
>marketing message) is a living, breathing person.

Amen to that.  As my Grandmother used to say, "Honey will attract
more flies than vinegar."  The honey, in this case is not insulting
the reader's intelligence with silly claims, and keeping your post
short to avoid wasting their time and bandwidth.

>We politely -- and in as few words as possible --
>asked first if they would like to receive info on
>the free newsletter.

Just so.  Short and to the point.

>...our sends were
>targeted.  It's fairly easy, although
>time-consuming, to visit -- in our case --
>a forum attracting dog owners and, thus,
>locate the addresses of dog owners.  As that
>is the audience for the e-mail pub, it's
>highly likely they'll be interested.

I'm sure this was just the beginning of your market targeting
efforts.  The number of dog-oriented places out there in cyberspace
must be staggering.  After, isn't the dog mankind's best friend?


+ Introductions

From: Frank Wiley 
Subject: Introduction


Up 'til now, my only experience with email has been to send and
receive messages on an individual basis.  Most of this has been
in relation to a web site which I built and maintain.

However, I am looking for ways to promote and increase traffic
to my site, possibly using email.  Any suggestions?

Frank Wiley * Online Karaoke Entertainment Guide
The Premier Karaoke Guide on the Internet *

+ The Corkboard

From:     Phil Doyle

A "B2B eNews" informal email survey suggests a spam solution.

"Internet Service Providers hold the power to set the price, and can
therefore control the volume of email. They can charge their
customers by the piece for sending email on an increasing, sliding
scale above a certain level. Sending email would remain free to
customers up to some reasonable amount. The number of spam
complaints will go down in proportion to the increase in the cost of
sending email. The additional revenues for Internet Service
Providers will provide funds needed for system upgrades and profit."

Phil Doyle

***  [moderator $.02]  ***

The above came to me as part of a much longer press release, but the
important part is here in it's entirety.  The idea of charging for
OUTGOING bulk e-mail seems, on the surface of it, to have some merit.
The assumption is that if you charge for bulk e-mail you will drive
the 'freebie' advertisers away.  It sounds good, but one issue comes
immediately to mind;

If ISP's charge for outgoing bulk e-mail then it follows that bulk
e-mail is acceptable practice...  as long as you pay for sending it.
This doesn't address the cost to the recipient, one of the main
objections to this practice. Nor does it address the inevitable
prolifigation of single purpose spam servers that people will set up
to bypass the ISPs.  IMHO if this practice is initiated then the
initial drop in spam will eventually be replaced by stronger, better
entrenched operations.

Mr Doyle also gives an address where you can participate in his
forum on this issue;

Feel free to share your thoughts here too  :)



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