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                     The E-Marketing Digest
                      Volume #2, Issue #12
                         May 22, 1997
                    Gary K. Foote, Moderator


Table of Contents

+ Moderator Comments

    "E-Marketing Series, Part III"
       - Gary K. Foote

+ New Subjects

    "A different sort of unsolicited E-Mail"
       - Vicki Simons

+ Ongoing

    "Anti-spam Legislation"
       - Russ Cobbe
       - Ted Husted

    "E-mail Surveys"
      - Marco De Biasi

    "Spam Filtering"
       - Gene Donohue
       - Dave Thuillier

    "Marketing without much control"
       - Susan Mathiesen

+ The Corkboard

    "Newsgroups e-mail agent"
       - Gary K. Foote

+ Introductions


                       Moderator Comments

Well Gang, I did it again.  I sent out Part III of the series and somehow
messed up the approval command line for majordomo.  That's why it
has no subject, is addressed from e-mark@buck and the chapter header
was missing.  I promise to get it right for Part IV, due out Friday.
If anyone would like a properly formatted copy just let me know and
I'll send one along to you ASAP.

Gary K. Foote

                          New Subjects

From: Vicki Simons 
Subject: A different sort of unsolicited E-Mail

From:    Vicki Simons
Subject: A different sort of unsolicited E-Mail

One aspect of unsolicited E-Mail that has not yet been mentioned in
this digest is "announcements".

My company, Probe Consultants, works in the area of consumer savings.
Part of our work is showing consumers how they can save time and money
on their expenses themselves.  For the weekly column I write, entitled
"Free Household Money Saving Tips", I research various products and
compare them on a per unit basis.  For specific examples, please see

For months, I wrote columns without announcement; but I figured others
would like to know the results of my research.  So, I began making one
unique NON-commercial announcement per week to the topic-relevant
newsgroup , notifying readers that
a new column had been written and posted.  I invite people to answer
for themselves questions like, "Is the store brand really the *least*
expensive?"  Readers may then examine the data and reach conclusions.

Shortly after noticing visits to the pages rising, I included forms for
people to submit requests to be notified of changes; I added a form
for people to submit suggestions on other topics they'd like to see
covered.  So far, input has been slow, but I'm ahead of where I was.

To date, I've received only one "flame" (who wrote my ISP and my
autoresponder provider, but not me!).  In the response my autoresponder
provider CC'd me, he vindicated me by saying, "This seems to be an
offer for free information about saving money, posted to a newsgroup
dedicated to that discussion. I don't see anything "commercial" or
inappropriate about it."  (Note:  I had been posting similar messages
to that newsgroup for weeks before the flame came....)

Furthermore, I believe that the research and announcements I perform
has a tiny but significant bearing on real estate and tourism in this
area.  Prices on products here in the South may induce folks from other
regions of the country to vacation or relocate here for retirement.  If
nothing else results from the research, I'm encouraging people to view
shopping in a different way, and I'm shopping more wisely myself.

Vicki Simons

------------------------- Probe Consultants --------------------------
     Free Tips and Fee-based services that save consumers money.
                    We make attorneys affordable.
262 Eastgate Drive, Suite 391   Aiken, SC   29803-7698    803/652-1727
-------- "Recovering Refunds for Consumers Every Single Day" ---------


From: Russ Cobbe 
Subject: SPAM discussion

Thought I would add my (Canadian) .02c worth on this subject.

As many people have brought up I find it hard to understand how a US
law would apply to me in Canada.  I think the whole issue is getting
way out of hand.  I sent an email to someone yesterday who had
previously contacted us and got the following response:

"You can address me personally.  But that doesn't change
the fact that I have no idea who you are.  I am not
a customer of Inline nor did I request any information
from Inline.  Thus your message is SPAM!!  Remove me
from any and all mailing lists you have.

Please be advised that begining 7/1/97, sending spam
to a Colorado resident is a violation of Colorado law."

What if I had gotten this persons name from their site and wanted to
contact them about something, is that SPAM?  If so, then let's all
pack our web sites up and go back to what we were doing.  Everyone is
going to be afraid to contact anyone on anything.  If the US does
implement the proposed legislation, then it is quite possible that we
will see the beginning of the end of the US as a world economic
force.  Other countries will be able to freely talk and create
business agreements while the US will be stuck, unable to communicate
and quickly wither away in the global economy.  Maybe this is a bit
harsh but something to think about.

BTW, I do not agree with SPAM such as that sent by CyberPromotions
but there is a place for targetted emails.  Whether they are done one
by one by hand or sent as a large group should not matter.

Russ Cobbe
Inline Internet Systems, Inc.
7305 Rapistan Court
Mississauga, ON L5N 5Z4
P: (905) 813-8800
F: (905) 813-8286

                 ***  NEW POST - Anti-spam Legislation  ***

From: "Ted Husted" 
Subject: Legislation against Spam

>Moving Spam Servers Off-Shore

Would probably not be effective, since the Feds could still prosecute the
business being promoted by the spam. Where the mail was sent from would not
matter much, if the advertisers are situate in the US, then they would be
one to prosecute, not just the service bureau they hired.

Legislation is not going to be a total solution. I'm still not sure myself
if it's a good idea. But it would save AOL, EarthLink, and the rest
thousands of dollars in legal fees chasing culprits in separate legal
actions. Sometimes, just the threat of legislation is enough to get
industries to self-regulate, and start using [BULK] or something in the
subject lines.

And, legislation is not going to help those of us making public postings.
We are still going to have to resort to technical solutions, like addresses
that lead to autoresponders that return a message with our real address.

But, now that I hear Geocities is talking about renting their email
addresses, we need to find ways to protect Internet pedestrians from email

I mean, it should would be nice to have an Internet white pages, but what
would CyberPromotions make of that?

-- Ted Husted (

                 ***  NEW POST - Anti-spam Legislation  ***

From: Gary K. Foote, Moderator
Subject: Anti-spam Legislation

I agree with the estimation that legislating against spam is not a
viable solution to the mass-mailed, untargeted e-mail explosion.
The fact that the majority of spam now comes from the US will soon
be a non-fact as more and more non-US companies move into the
business.  If US legislation prevents her citizens from pursuing a
business that the majority of other citizens of the world are
profiting from, then two things will most likely happen;

  1)  The big US players will create foreign entities to perform
this business for them. These businessmen will not be prosecuted for
their actions.  As a US citizen I can invest in any foreign business
I wish, without fear of being subject to prosecution by the US if
that foreign business breaks no US laws on US soil.  I'm not a
lawyer - I don't even play one on TV - but I know many foreign
investors who would likely be in jail right now if this were not

  2)  There will be a number of non-US formed companies who will
become big players simply because the US companies that would have
been born and grown will have been cut off by local legislation
before they even see the light of day.  Is this bad?  No, not to
non-US companies, but to the US businessman who has yet another
possible source of income cut off because legislators have to get
involved in yet another facet of life, well...


                 ***  NEW POST - E-mail Survey  ***

From: Marco De Biasi 
Subject: e-mail surveys


In this first part I will answer Patrick M. van der Valk's question about
programs for scheduling e-mail surveys. Just remember that e-mail pages are
ASCII texts so that you can easily write a few rows of program yourself just
by using a programming langauge such as c, tbasic, tpascal or whatever else
you are skilled in. In this way you can create report files that you can
elaborate with your statistical package. This is surely faster (and less
expensive) than finding out a well-done program, and this is what I will do
in my survey.

But I wrote this (forget my awful english) mainly for another reason. I'm
planning a survey for my graduation thesis. I will send questionnaires via
e-mail to a sample of the italian on-line businesses, and I am searching for
some studies (or simple suggestions) that could help me do this in the best
way, in order to have the largest redemption as possible.

Particulary I would like info on these topics:

1) Use of pre-notifications
2) Use of reminders
3) Maximum lenght of the sechedule
4) Comparison of response rates (and contents) between e-mail and simple
mail surveys

Moreover can anyone suggest me if it is better to use this methodology
instead of sending a request to come to our site and fill the schedule
directly on-line (just like GVU's WWW surveys, for example)? I've found very
little about this stuff, yet, just a couple of articles on the Journal of
the Market Research Society.

Thanks a lot (and great job, Gary)

Marco De Biasi
University of Bologna

                 ***  NEW POST - Spam Filtering  ***

From: Gap Mtn Technologies 
Subject: Spam Filters

One major problems pops out with Edwin Hayward's Spam Filter concept of
putting thresholds on incoming and outgoing identical messages.

Many people subscribe to discussion lists and newsletters which send out
identical messages to 100's or 1000's of people.  Let's say more then 50
people (Edwin's threshold) from AOL belong to this list.  Everyday this
list would be held up from those people receiving it.

Outgoing mail would have the same problem.  I send a weekly update to the
people in my downline in a network marketing program I belong to.  Also if
I need my people to take immediate action I send them an email.  With
Edwin's threshold my people would not be able to take that immediate action
because my email would be spooled for 24 hours.

I applaud Edwin for using creative thinking but I have a problem with
taking the "instant" out of this instant communication vehicle.

Gene Donohue                     Have you taken our Internet Survey?
Gap Mtn Technologies    

LET THE INTERNET SELL FOR YOU. Autoresponders, web space, domain names,
secured forms, and more.  Visit our site at

Gap Mtn Technologies can also design your web site!

                 ***  NEW POST - Spam Filtering  ***

From: Dreamer 
Subject: Re: The E-Marketing Digest, V2, #11

> Edwin Hayward, Tokyo, Japan wrote:

> to be worked out, but I believe the above presents a viable, if brute
> force, way of dealing with spammers. If any kind of legislation is
> passed putting the onus on ISPs to prevent spamming, this software
> could be very useful.
> NOTE: the software could function equally well for OUTGOING mail. All
> mail for 24 hours would be spooled and people sending more than 50
> identical mails would find that their mail is _briefly_ held up for
> checking.

Awsome Idea!  Legislation which would require the ISP to review bulk
quantities of outgoing Email for spam and be held subject to hefty
Legislation should also require that the sender of bulk Email use their
correct return address. Outgoing ISP responsible for this check as well.

This would place the responsibility of SPAM back in the hands of the ISP
who allows bulk Email to be SPAMMED to the net. Other ISPs would check
large quantities of incoming mail (same message...) and report misuse
to a central authority. The central authority would then address the
issue with the offending ISP via increasing fines. This would still
for targeted Email as well as allowing for bulk mailings such as this


The software should be easier to develop by a software wiz than that
currently used to pick addresses from newsgroups.
   ----If firstmessage = nextmessage then a=a+1 ----
   ----When a  assigned quantity then flag human...

Dave Thuillier
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++       dreamers_den
  Collectable Card Games                   Models & Hobby Materials
     Role Playing Games                        Unique Tee Shirts
             Fantasy & Sci-FI Books and Audio

          ***  NEW POST - Marketing without Much Control  ***

From: "Susan Mathiesen" 
Subject: Re:  Marketing Without Much Control

Tereson Dupuy wrote:

>Does anyone have any suggestions as to how I can continue on an ongoing
>basis to promote these web sites other than the general listings with
>search engines and directories.  There is only so much of that to go

I have found advertising in e-zines and newsletters to be very effective,
especially those that only accept one or a few sponsorship ads in each
issue.   You will need to find targeted newsletters for the sites that you
promote.  A very good resource of e-zines by subject/keyword is as .  Advertising in some of these can be
extremely cost effective if they are well-targeted.  There is also a
directory of sponsorable newsletters/lists at , however, it is a fairly new directory and
was not an overwhelming list the last time I looked.  Another resource for
finding places to advertise is at .

There are also some sites that allow you to post new URL announcements
which are then sent by e-mail to those who have requested them, for
example, Net Announce (part of All-in-One-Promotion) at and Email Announce at .  Your posting should be more newsworthy than
commercial in order to get listed.

Classified ads, both free and fee, are an option.  The most comprehensive
list of classified sites is at .  I find it
difficult to determine which classified sites are most effective, perhaps
other members of the list can advise.

Another interesting site is at .  You can
list your autoresponder documents by subject for free, so if any of the
sites you promote use autoresponders, you may wish to list these.

There are also the targeted, opt-in direct mail sites that have been
discussed in earlier issues of this newsletter.

Susan Mathiesen
Build residual income by placing FREE ads online.
Send any message to
or visit

                          The Corkboard

Hi everyone,

Here's a little service that could save lots of hours browsing
the newsgroups looking for posts to respond to.  It is a paid
service.  Here are the details;

The price is $12 per year payable in advance, to receive postings
for up to six different newsgroups.



"How am I going to get people to visit my web site, if I don't take the
risk, and spam newsgroups, or send out unsolicited e-mails? This is a
question asked by many web site promoters, and until now the answers have
not been very satisfying. But now, thnaks to the newly launched
Intellinews service, their is a better answer." says Raymond Sarrio
Intellinews co-founder and owner of The Raymond Sarrio Company a
successfull ham radio web store

Intellinews is a smart agent that searches preselected newsgroups for
postings that match a subscribers filtering criteria. When a match is
found the subscriber receives the post by e-mail. Subscribers can change
their newsgroups and search criteria at any time through the Intellinews
web site


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